[R-R-R-R-R-RELAPSE (one night only)]

Hey all,

My name is Duffman, and I officially relapsed. 

I went for 2 years without a single dose of Adderall - and yet tonight, I took 25mg of Dexedrine. Why? Why would I do this after so long? I made it through my doctorate program, I made it through my boards exam, I made it through my engagement without Adderall in my system, yet I failed tonight. What went wrong? 

To put it simply: I put myself in a situation where I didn't feel like "I" was enough. 

Over the past couple years, I've really began to reacquaint myself to who I naturally am. I'm not perfect. I'm learning that I'm no superman and do have faults that require some serious work in order to function at my job and overall lifestyle. I've been able to manage myself at my new job and even began to thrive. I've learned that my "big picture" thinking is exceptional but my "detail oriented" thinking is lacking and requires serious work. I've made accommodations to this deficit by adhering a strict code of organization through my smart phone using google calendar. I do fail to keep up with routine tasks from time-to-time, but I usually make up for it and have made myself a valuable asset to my company over the past year.

Since quitting Adderall, I finally feel like my fiancee and I have bonded on a whole other level. When I was cracked out on Adderall, I was never "there" for my then girlfriend. I was emotionally absent and wasn't able to fully support her in her time of need. She either experienced me when I was "peaking" on my dose where I'd talk her ear off OR she would experience me when I was crashing and became a void of hatred and loathing. It's a miracle she stayed with me during those tough times. Now, off Adderall, I feel like we're connecting in ways I never thought possible. She feels secure now I'm grounded in reality. I'm there WITH her at all times, for better or worse. I love this woman, and wouldn't trade her for anything. 

So far, so good.. so what ACTUALLY made you relapse duffman?

It's silly - but here it is. I went to an event today where my idol would give a lecture. I respect this gentleman very much and I wanted to be 100% present throughout the duration of his event. I don't revere too many people. I think people are people with their own set of weaknesses and biases. But this guy, I felt, changed my life and dreamed of the day I would finally be able to ask him a question. I didn't want to blow it. This would probably be my only change to ask him something. 

That thought of "only opportunity" consumed my mind and feasted on my will power. I'm objectively a smart guy, but I'm also kinda an airhead at times. This was a once in a lifetime opportunity. I mean, how often does anyone actually meet and be given the opportunity to ask a question directed towards their "hero"? Again, I didn't want to blow it!! So what did I do? I opened my emergency stash of dexedrine, broke a pill into quarters, and took a quarter. I didn't feel enough, so I took another quarter pill. Still, not enough! I was in too deep! I took ANOTHER quarter pill. Now, I felt like my heart was thumping out of my chest and the thoughts in my mind were in overdrive. I was SOOOO ready for this once in a lifetime opportunity. 

So, it was my turn to ask a question. I walked up to the mic, licked my lips, and then... disaster. A fucking disaster. I couldn't put forth a coherent question. The speaker gave me a confused look and asked me if I had a question hidden in my rambling, incoherent rant. I really didn't know what I wanted to ask, so he answered a different question and moved on to the next person. 

I deserve what happened to me. I don't blame the speaker. He handled it in a professional way. 

I filled my last "stash" of Adderall with water and threw it in the dumpster outside. This should've been done long ago, but I always thought it was a good idea to keep a stash on hand just in case I needed it for dire circumstances. Little did I know that taking it would actually worsen my performance and embarrass me in front of a crowd of people - including my fiancee. 

Overall, I'm glad I was able to experience what I went through tonight. It confirmed that Adderall does not enhance me in the slightest. I would've been fine if I just didn't take the damned pill! I'm done. Officially. I'm done with the neurotoxin Adderall. It's now 2:30 AM and I'm sitting here at my computer unable to sleep.

To all those wondering if hopping back on Adderall will solve their problems, I would implore you to resist the temptation and keep on trucking forward. Without Adderall, I've achieved things I never thought possible. It's time to accept myself for who I am. This doesn't mean surrender, by the way. Far from it. I truly believe each and every one of us has room to grow. In order to grow, you must first admit that you're human and accept responsibility of who you are. If you're going to correct any problems in your life, you must first acknowledge that they exist in the first place! It's the only path forward.  

[How long did you give yourself a pass?]

On 2/9/2018 at 4:00 PM, Speeder906 said:

How long after quitting did you let yourself be lazy? I have heard some people need some recovery time and others need to just go right back into their life. 

Few days clean and feel lazy and just wanna lay around all weekend eating.. but then another part of me knows I'm getting fatter by the day and I should go to the gym.  

Where do you guys land on this?

Everyone will probably provide a different answer on this one because it all depends what our preferred "escape" method to push through the cravings and lethargy associated with withdrawal. I performed light exercise almost immediately. But exercise is my escape - my salvation - during withdrawal. The one thing that allowed me to feel anything when I could otherwise feel nothing. I will say that the long walks in the park while listened to audiobooks proved to be more helpful early on than gym exercise. However, at some point (probably around 3 months) I started taking weight lifting seriously. I ordered a book off Amazon and stuck to the program and have been at it ever since. I'm pathologically afraid of weight gain, so the lay around and eat whatever I want method would've further stressed me out and probably would've resulted in a relapse.

[I want to die.]

On 2/11/2018 at 5:09 PM, Kiona said:

I live with my dad because I can't afford rent anywhere else; I pay him cheap rent. And he's had enough of my depression, always has. I can barely make myself get out of bed, and sometimes I can't even do that. He's spent every day of my recovery telling me how I'm hurting him by not doing things, that I'm lazy, that I'm worthless. Once he stood over me while I was crying in bed and promised to make me even more miserable than I already was. That if I don't start doing things and stop stressing him out and stop making the entire house darker, he's going to throw me and my shit onto the street without hesitation. He's "had enough" of my attitude.

Today as I was leaving for work, he told me that I need to "stay away, leave and just stay away," he doesn't want me here. He's sick of me.

I'm sick of me. I'm sick of being depressed. I'm sick of having to struggle to get out of bed in the morning. I'm sick of being told I'm worthless for it. I want to die. I want everything to end. I can't take this shit anymore, and I'm not going to. I would have already ended it, but I can't find a painless way to kill myself. I think I want to OD on something, but I don't have anything to OD on. I have access to a gun, but I'm afraid I won't hit my brain stem and then I'll be forced to live an even shittier life.

I hate being alive.

Maybe I'll get over this. I don't know if that'll be possible when I'm sleeping in my car, but maybe I will. I don't know. I'm just sick of it all.

Yo Kiona, I'm up for talking whenever you are. I have suicidal thoughts every so often. They're a part of me. It's my brain wanting to opt out.. let go.. evade responsibility and be free at last. But, you must realize - as I learned to - that these thoughts are just that, thoughts. Mental perturbations that occur whenever my life feels like it's in free fall. They're not representing some grand realization that my life is worthless and I'd be better off dead. Your dad said things he probably immensely regrets now. We all say those things sometimes to people we love. Give yourself a week to reconsider. Talk to someone first. 

[I'm No Superman]

So I was at the gym yesterday doing an intense cardio session when the song "Handlebars" by Flobots came up on my playlist. It's a song that has a good cadence and flow to it - but I realized I never actually listened to the lyrics. So, I took the effort to listen to what the song was about, trying to discern the meaning behind the lyrics. I initially came to the conclusion that there was no meaning to the song and it was just a bunch of disjointed statements. However, upon closer inspection (and perhaps assigning my own experience to the lyrics), it began to make me reflect upon the progressive nature of my mental instability on Adderall and how I'm finally connected with reality now that I'm off the stuff. It starts off by saying how he can do things like "Ride his bike with no handlebars" and progressively becomes more absurd to the point where he can "End the planet in a holocaust", if he wanted to. 

When I first used Adderall, I viewed it like a key that unlocked my brain for the first time. Finally I was able to unleash who I was to the world! My social anxiety that plagued my social interactions for the first 22 years of my life vanished and I was given a boost of confidence that made me feel like I had control over my fate. This, as we all know and experienced, sets the stage for eventually, inevitably and invariably, spiraling out of control. 

My goals in life began to shift in a dramatic fashion.. to the extent to where they eventually began to depart from reality. Reflecting back on this makes me cringe because it made so my sense at the time. But this is the insidious nature of psychosis. These thoughts make absolute sense to the person going through the psychosis whereas the outside observer is thinking "this person has clearly lost their mind and I'm going to back away before I'm caught in this whirlwind of madness". 

When I first started using, I ditched the idea of becoming a physical therapist and wanted to become a doctor because it would allow me more control and freedom to do what I wanted to do (reasonable so far). But I didn't want to become any doctor - I wanted to become a famous doctor - a doctor who was the leading authority on pain, nutrition, and overall wellness. I pictured myself going through TV interviews and perhaps having my own show. I found myself prepping what I would say at academic conferences where everyone would be gushing over my absolute brilliance (still have the word document on my old computer with what I would say). I've also been told I have a good sense of humor and wanted to become a stand up comedian as well.. on the side or something. So I began typing out ideas for what kind of shows I would create, something along the lines of Dave Chapelle's show with various skits, once I began to be noticed for my comedic talent. But wait, why stop there? What about society as a whole? The world needs to be rescued and my overarching intellectual brilliance is the cure. So I began to write ideas how I would run for public office and eventually become a prominent figure in Washington DC - a puppet master who was REALLY the guy in charge behind the scenes.. on top of being a world-renowned physician and famous hollywood comedian, of course. 

Know what's really funny about all that shit I wrote above? I thought of all of those delicious futures while sitting at my computer playing video games high on Adderall - doing nothing to actually progress towards these aspirations. After I finished my undergraduate degree, I took off a year to plan how to begin my worldly domination. I would pop enough Vyvanse (Or other stimulant medication) to give me that euphoric rush so I could feel invincible and write down all I was going to do with my life.. only to end up obsessing over some detail and researching it incessantly and eventually playing video games till I crashed. That's the thing about these stimulant medications though, they provide the FEELING of succeeding at something. You begin to exist in your own reality where you feel like you've accomplished all these great things already. It skips over the hard work and sacrifice it requires to get to these circumstances and instead allows you to feel the end result of accomplishing something great without actually doing anything. 

Fast forward to now. 

I'm now a physical therapist after passing my state board exam without Adderall (something I did not think I would be able to accomplish)!! I have a great job that pays very well and my relationships with the people in my inner circle have never been stronger. I'm finally reconnected with reality. One thing I've learned is I'm no superman - and this is a good... no... necessary step to moving forward in life. Any of the above-mentioned lifestyles I was dreaming about on Adderall in itself requires tons of hard work, sacrifice, and frankly luck to accomplish. I could not move forward in life while my mind was in an alternate reality. 

Thank you for reading.

[Just Got Dumped]

6 hours ago, Cheeri0 said:

Hey everyone. I've been clean from adderall for 1 year now (woo) and sober from alcohol for 11 months. This should be a happy time and an upbeat/celebratory post, but I'm struggling. My boyfriend of three years just ended things last night.

Ultimately, I'm not sure if he could get past all the things I put him through when I was using. I know I have to accept the consequences of my actions, but I'm just beyond devastated right now. I really thought he was the one and I'm still so in love with him. I just don't know where to go from here. I don't want it to impact my recovery, but fuck. I've never hurt this bad.

 

Truly a bittersweet moment for you. Right now, you need to take care of yourself instead of worrying about accepting the consequences of your past actions. I understand you're in a lot of pain right now and Adderall and/or alcohol may seem like very tempting options because they're reliably numbed you out in the past. But do not give in. This will probably be your most challenging trial yet. 

[Share Your Post Quit Accomplishments]

I quit Adderall in the middle of physical therapy school and am now a Doctor of Physical Therapy. Worked a full day today (first day with a full case-load at my new job) and it went great despite having some very challenging patients. I'm pretty tired now but am still going to hit the gym in about a half hour or so. My new goal is to morph my body into something I'm proud of. I've always been semi-strong, but I've never been jacked (ripped, swole, whatever you want to call it) and I'm still carrying around some residual fat from quitting Adderall. To accomplish this, I've made a commitment with myself to hit the gym for 6 days a week with one of those days purely dedicated to cardio. 

If I may ask, what are you wanting to accomplish? 

[The Most Important Factor For Quitting Adderall...]

I've been thinking about what separates people who succeed with quitting and staying off Adderall vs the people who tend to waver in their commitment to quitting the drug. We come from different backgrounds.. are different ages.. and have differing perspectives on life. And yet, none of these factors seem to correlate well to future success of quitting and stay off Adderall.. So what gives? What factor can explain this phenomenon? Can a single factor even be held responsible? I believe there is.

I wish to contend that the most important factor for quitting Adderall is.. Ownership... ownership over what Duffman? Ownership over one's own situation and one's own commitment to quitting Adderall... .. really? That's the best he can come up with? You're probably thinking. Hear me out though.

I've noticed after reading hundreds of posts on this forum that there are two types of people: People who designate themselves as the victim and search for who is at fault for their current situation (e.g. that damned Dr gave me another script!! How DARE they?) or people who accept responsibility for their situation and move forward to figuring out how to better than situation. 

Before I continue forward, let me clarify something. What's the difference between 'being at fault' for something vs 'being responsible' for something? I bolded the word responsibility above for a reason and it's important: It may or may not be your fault or anyone's fault that you're in your current situation with Adderall.. It's next to useless to figure out who is at fault.. However, it is your RESPONSIBILITY to figure out the best way forward at this point. 

So taking ownership of your situation also means taking responsibility for your recovery. How it happened doesn't matter anymore. The only thing that matters is how to move forward given your unique circumstances. Posting on here with your concerns and your struggles has value, don't get me wrong.. I get it, trust me. But, at some point, you need to recognize that these problems are in fact your problems and YOU are the one who is responsible for them. This is where taking ownership comes into play. These are two examples:

1) Feel yourself gaining weight? Recognize this is common with quitting stimulants and begin eating a healthier diet and initiate a workout routine. It's not fair how this happens, but doing something about it is the only way forward. 

2) Feel yourself sapped of motivation? This is also common. Start by doing something small and build from it. I realized after taking a short walk I would experience a small but noticeable surge in motivation to do what needed to be done. 

Quitting Adderall is the single best thing you can do for your current and future health. You know this. Quitting this drug has not only increased my quality of life, but saved my life. I was in free fall during the peak of my Adderall abuse and the landing wasn't looking pretty. The only direction to move is forward. Do this for yourself. Quit Adderall now. And to do this, you must take full ownership of your situation. 

So I want to end this with a series of questions:

Is quitting Adderall a path you want to travel? Did anyone say it would be easy?... Do you have a choice?

 

Thank you for reading.

 

[How Can This Possibly Be 8 Years Later?]

I'm able to relate to quite a bit of your journey with Adderall (albeit not getting back on it after two years, whew!). I, too, lost one of my best friends while I was in the midst of my Adderall addiction. Just thinking about it still makes me pause and my heart to sink a bit. He was a childhood friend from about the age of 8-9 and we formed a group of friends and hung out periodically over the years (we called each other 'The Four Horseman', awesome I know). I really have fond memories of those times and regret throwing away what I had in exchange for my fix of stimulant medication. What really got me was looking on his Facebook one day and seeing his bachelor party (I didn't even know he was engaged) and there were the three others of 'The Four Horseman' there doing shots and having a great time.. without me. Looking back, it's quite obvious why I lost him as a friend. I literally just cringed thinking about some of the things I said on Facebook or through text messages we had when I was cracked out on Adderall. Thinking about that situation helps remind me what I value in life.. what truly makes life worth living and grants the path to happiness is being surrounded by people who I love to be around. It sounds sappy, and probably is, but it's true.

Why am I telling you this? Well, what do you value? Do you value being a cracked-out employee who grinds away for days at a time? It sounds like one of the things you value is being skinny, do you need Adderall for that? Is it even worth it if you socially isolate yourself with Adderall? Being off Adderall, I'm able to connect with people again. When I took Adderall in class, I thought everyone revered my intellectual prowess and admired my lightning-quick wit. After quitting Adderall and speaking with a group of friends I made (after quitting), one of them said "You know, you're pretty cool. We used to think you were a socially awkward weirdo who was kinda a kiss ass in class". I appreciated his forthrightness. 

What is it you want out of life? 

 

[Adderall caused thyroid/adrenal issues?]

12 hours ago, Kimber said:

I've been attempting to quit for a couple of months.  Down to 20-30 mg /day.

Does anyone think Adderall causes thyroid and/or adrenal problems?  I have over researched this to the point of confusion and am afraid from what I've read that I can make it worse.  My neck/throat area sometimes feels like it has a pulsing heartbeat and is really sore when I wake up, plus my body is always really hot, but feet and hands sometime cold.  Like temperature gauge is off.

1.  If stop Adderall cold turkey can this possible cause irreparable damage?

2.  Any books or website suggestions for a SIMPLE TO FOLLOW, step by step on how to safely heal, help and/or repair any thyroid and/or adrenal problems.  Like I said I have over bombarded myself with information and feel stuck.

This really is the pits.  Tired of Adderall totally taking up my life...whether obsessing about not using it, then if I take it, obsessing and beat myself up for succumbing, then off to obsessively clean house and do more research!  I've killed 100's of trees with all my printed info on this crap..

 

You know, I went down the same rabbit hole trying to figure out how to heal my thyroid and/or how to heal my adrenal glands. I bought tons of audiobooks, read tons of articles on various websites, and read countless anecdotes online about how to heal my thyroid and/or adrenal glands. Well, I took a blood test to see what my TSH looked like and it was within normal limits, so I gave up on the thyroid and focused on my adrenal glands. The best book I found, which has both the information and a guide for healing your adrenal glands, is called "The Adrenal Reset Diet: Strategically Cycle Carbs and Proteins to Lose Weight, Balance Hormones, and Move from Stressed to Thriving" by Alan Christianson. It seemed to help, but I also stopped taking stimulant medications entirely when I followed the protocol, so I can't say with 100% certainty that this was the reason why I started feeling better (eventually). Worth look into, good information. As @Greg said above, you need to stop the Adderall and let your begin the healing process. You're still taking something that is artificially jacking up various neurotransmitters and catecholamines, thus inhibiting your body's ability to begin healing and rebalancing itself. 

[Tried Many Times to Quit]

So there are people who come to these forums with a sort of defensive stance on Adderall where they admit it's becoming a problem but aren't truly ready to give it up. They'll suggest trying to take a "controlled, moderate dose, you know, as prescribed" or "I'll just take it as needed", but as you have (rightfully) stated, that just doesn't work, at least for not any meaningful amount of time. I tried the "I'll just take it AS NEEDED approach!", but then I'll have an interview where I'll think "Okay, this is definitely a time where I'm going to take Adderall". Then the first day comes up, "Well, I need to make a good first impression! *Takes Adderall*". Second week comes up, "They're starting to give me more responsibilities, better take an Adderall so I can keep up with the pace", and right back down the path of 'taking mega doses and running out early' I go. 

You're ripe for the quittin', now you're just needing a plan of escape. Sounds like you have a mixed support system at home. They're probably willing to show you unconditional support for whatever you do, but may not be able to relate to what you're going through. That's where these forums come in. We get it. That's why I've been on here for almost two years. I went the cold turkey approach because I was still in school and I could sort of coast under the radar. I didn't have any real responsibilities besides exist in class, occasionally interact with people for an assignment, and answer a series of multiple choice questions for the exams. Working is a different story and you may want to ask some others about a tapering schedule where you gradually lower your dose over a series of weeks (sometimes months) till you eventually come off entirely. It'll be a softer landing and should allow you to keep working. 

Welcome aboard! This may be one of the toughest things you've ever had to do, but it's absolutely worth it. I've been off for 1 year and 8 months after using Adderall (and vyvanse.. and zenzedi.. and all variants of stimulants) for 1 year and abusing Adderall for 5 years. I was so far into addiction that I went into stimulant-induced psychosis. I'm doing great now. I still can't believe where I started and where I am now. I really.. REALLY.. thought I was a lost cause and I'd be on Adderall till my aorta would rupture from the extremely high blood pressure it gave me. You can do this!!

[Medical Anxiety/Chest Pain after a Year Clean]

You know, I can't find it now, but I once made a post on here about all the potential health problems I thought I accrued throughout my years of abuse. Thinking about it now makes me cringe because of how outlandish my worries were. I remember I thought I had some combination of Cushing's syndrome, chronic fatigue syndrome, adrenal fatigue, a vast array of heart conditions.. just a bunch of stuff and all the product of years of Adderall abuse. And I've seen this before from other users on this forum too. We tend to become obsessive about every little health-related thing and begin searching for anecdotes on the internet to support our theory that our health is in peril. In reality, it was my anxiety on overdrive. I went to multiple doctors to discuss my worries and they all gave me the same wide-eyed expression and would promptly begin talking to me about my mental health, sometimes offering an antidepressant or anti-anxiety medication. What I'm getting at is you're not alone with this anxiety about your health after Adderall abuse. And no, I'm not saying you SHOULDN'T go to a physician, I'm not qualified to judge that over the internet. But if they run tests and you come back normal and they don't seem alarmed, then I would trust their judgment. Tell your physician everything. They've heard it all and would relieved that you're being forthright with them so they can help you. 

[My Best Shot at an Honest Life]

First off, I would also like to compliment you on your ability to convey your thoughts and feelings through writing. Your writing style is very eloquent and powerfully captures the various moods and emotions you've been experiencing throughout this journey. Like many mini-memoirs (as Cheeri0 cleverly put it) on this site, I can profoundly relate to a lot of what you're saying. 

I read the entirety of your post last night (very late last night... with a couple of drinks in me) and missed where you might've stated this, but were you on Adderall when you wrote this? I ask because, through personal experience and speaking to others who are on Adderall, there tends to be certain shared characteristics with someone's.. let's call it delivery of information, when they're peaking on Adderall. This includes a certain extensiveness when conveying information and a stream of consciousness quality to their writing/speaking, which I picked up a lot on in your post. 

Let me ask, are you hesitating quitting Adderall because you're afraid you will lose your ability to think like you do when you're on it? If not, what's keeping you coming back to it? From what I remember reading last night, your post creates a perfect picture of a steady descent in your quality of life after you starting using (abusing) Adderall. You have a beautiful mind, I can tell with how you articulate yourself and the fact that you're a neuroscientist, but I'm still struggling to gauge why this is even a decision. Relative to your potential, you're in a low place right now, which sounds like an inherent bad thing but this is exactly the catalyst needed for change. There's no better time in your life to quit than now. I quit in the middle of physical therapy school because I just couldn't stand the person I became (socially withdrawn, uncaring, cold, callous, anxious and a whole bunch of other adjectives to describe someone who is just plain miserable and miserable to be around), and I have not one moments regret about my decision. What Greg said above is absolutely on the money. On Adderall, I was accomplishing a bunch of things.. in my own deluded reality. Objectively, my life was in free fall and was ready to lose everything (my relationship, my close friends.. even my future career as I started having panic attacks during social interactions). 

Do it. Quit now and post your progression on this site. We've been where you're at, trust me. It will be the single best decision you've ever made in your life. 

 

[Where is everyone from?]

Dallas, TX. Interesting to see a few fellow Texans here. Houston is the one major city of Texas where I absolutely refuse to move, for the reasons Subtracterall listed above + overcrowded. 

[I finally made the decision to stop being fat and depressed and stop feeling sorry for myself]

This is a perfect example of taking ownership of your situation and proactively doing something about it. It's okay to logon to vent on these forums. I mean, I get it. But, after a while, you start to realize that these problems are yours. You're the one experiencing the pain. And you're the one who can do something about it. I'm very happy to hear you're finding some relief and gaining some control back in your life. It's empowering to find something that provides you some control over your problems. I, too, use exercise as a tool to manage and ultimately minimize my problems/suffering throughout this recovery process. I personally cannot imagine recovering from Adderall without exercising. But, to each their own. If exercise just really isn't their thing, then I hope they find something. Keep us updated on your progress!!

[MODAFINIL]

Hmm.. worth a shot? It did not relieve any fatigue-related symptoms I was experiencing early on in my post-Adderall recovery. However, I've read from multiple sources that people's response to this drug varies greatly, meaning some people tend to have a very positive experience from Modafinil while others tend to experience nothing more than a headache. I certainly belong in the latter group, but who knows, you may respond well to it. I know the abuse potential with Modafinil is relatively low compared to Adderall. This must be in part due to the apparent lack of euphoric feelings from taking Modafinil. 

Hope you find some relief soon. 

[MODAFINIL]

Yes, I have tried to use Modafinil in place of Adderall. It's important to know that Modafinil is a wakefulness promoting agent, not a stimulant. Here are my experiences:

-It does not give any detectable sense of euphoria. 

-I didn't even notice it was doing anything at first. The only indication I got that it was working (or doing ANYTHING for that matter) was being unable to fall asleep at night. It pretty much removed the sensation of sleepiness. Hence it being correctly labeled as a 'wakefulness promoting agent'.

-Close friends and family members noticed I was more "edgy" while on Modafinil. I experienced this as increased anxiety.

-Gave me a HUGE headache at the end of the day. 

-Gave me significant jaw tightness. 

-Made my piss smell funky. 

-No real or perceived cognitive benefits (though people purport to experience cognitive enhancement in various online forums).

-And perhaps most importantly did NOT diminish any effects of Adderall withdrawal. 

 

[On Ughhh Days..]

So I was reflecting on a few posts I've made recently and realized I've sort of depicted myself as a semi-superhero with how well I'm doing with this whole recovery ordeal. This, however, is not the whole picture. It's not a lie, because I did feel great on those days when I choose to write these posts. But in interest of being fair and balanced, I'm choosing to write this post on a day where I'm not feeling so great, a day where I could aptly describe my mood in one word (or utterance): 'Ugh...'. 

I can tell it's going to be an 'Ughh Day' from the moment I wake up, because it feels like I didn't get any quality sleep. I know I slept. I wasn't just waiting in bed for 6-7 hours waiting for the alarm to go off, but I don't feel refreshed upon waking. On these days, it feels like my mental processing speed takes a hit. Writing this post is taking me at least 2x as long because organizing my thoughts into a clear, discernible message is more difficult. My sense of humor (which is a very valuable asset with all my social interactions) seems to be less 'on-point' and less creative in nature. There's this haziness quality to my thoughts. For the reasons listed above, my will to socialize is greatly diminished.

Even my physical attributes seem to take a hit on these days. I tend to have lower energy and less motivation. I'm an avid weightlifter/stairmaster kinda guy, but on these days I go to the gym more out of habit rather than looking forward to improving my physique (which is why in previous posts I emphasize developing a habit of exercising as opposed to waiting till you 'feel' like exercising!). 

Now, I did NOT choose to write this message to scare any of you. There is a spectrum here between feeling 'Ugh' and feeling 'Great' and overall I'm trending in a positive direction ever since I quit taking Adderall, I cannot emphasize that point enough. However, some of the most helpful posts I've read on this forum have been an honest and candid discussion of how, on some days and times throughout your respective recovery, you're not going to feel great and that's OK!

Perhaps this is the natural variation in energy/moods that most normal people experience. I mean, I think everyone (besides people with some sort of unipolar mania) have low energy and high energy days. With taking Adderall for the past 5 years, I'm used to the following formula: 1) Wake up feeling BLEHH, 2) Take Adderall, wait for it to kick-in, 3) Feel Adderall kick-in, move forward with my day, 4) Begin feeling Adderall wear-off, negative thoughts start consuming my mind, 5) Take another Adderall OR experience the throes of crashing if I didn't have another Adderall to take (including but not limited to: unbearable anxiety, pounding heart rate with concomitant 'whooshing' sound through my carotid arteries, depression, self-loathing, agitation, social isolation, etc.), 6) Take sleeping pill, go to bed, rinse-and-repeat. It is a lot more predictable.. or rather predictably awful more accurately. 

How often do these 'Ughhh Days' occur at my stage in recovery (~16 months-ish)? Not too often, though I haven't been able to detect a clear reason as to why they surface when they do occur. It seems to be negatively correlated with the amount of time I've been off Adderall (meaning the longer I've been off Adderall, the less frequently these 'Ughhh Days' occur). 

If you're new here and don't know my history, please don't take this as a reason to take Adderall again, I'm merely attempting to show how you're going to experience some bad days in your recovery, and that is normal!! Quitting Adderall is, again, the best single thing I've ever done for myself. I'm (despite the tone of this post) the happiest I've been in.. well.. years I suppose, it's been long enough that I cannot recall a time where I've been feeling this good.. this 'normal'. 

Thank you for reading. 

-Duffman

[Spiritual Awakening or Psychosis?]

Interesting insights and yes I can say I've had a similar experience through my Adderall years that still impacts my thinking to this day. I can't say I've ever been a very religious person at any point in my life, but taking Adderall really opened my mind to philosophy surrounding morality and scientific understanding. I remember listening to the book "A Short History of Nearly Everything" and it absolutely blew my mind. It really served to open to floodgates to my desire to understand the universe, our planet, people and societies, science, and moral values. I listened to the book again off my meds and still found it profoundly entertaining to listen to. In fact, I feel I truly understand things more accurately off Adderall, as I realized about 10 minutes into the book that I didn't absorb very much on my first go-round under the influence. There's a term popularized by (or perhaps created by) Richard Dawkins called "Consciousness Raising", which implies a process by which people are exposed to information or ways of thinking that expand their own thinking, very often permanently. I believe this term Consciousness Raising is what you and I went through when we took Adderall. 

[I am afraid.]

Oh yeah - you are DEFINITELY ready to quit Adderall. This self-loathing thing you're doing is actually progress, though I'm sorry you're going through it. And no, you do not deserve to be alone, though I understand where you're coming from, I felt the same way towards the end of my stimulant addiction. What you're going through now is a process of self-realization. You're realizing how you've affected the people around you with your Adderall usage and beginning to take ownership of the situation. This does not mean you're a monster or a psychopath. If you were a natural "monster" or psychopath, you would've been this way prior to Adderall, which is sounds like you weren't. Your brain is going through a tumultuous journey of fluctuating levels of neurotransmitters. Your brain cannot strike a balance, so it sends you into various states ranging from panic, to depression, to disassociation, and to apathy. Just remind yourself - THIS IS PART OF THE PROCESS. This isn't some grand realization that you're a terrible person no matter how much your brain is trying to convince you otherwise. 

You're going to be tested throughout this process, but whatever happens, you will handle it. I probably had to tell myself that upwards to a million times throughout my recovery.. 'Whatever happens, I will handle it'. 

 

Please reach out to me or anyone else on this board if you need help, and keep posting!! 

[I am afraid.]

I'm able to identify with a lot of the stuff you mentioned, so I'll give my perspective (currently 16ish months clean from a 5+ year addiction to vyvanse/adderall/zenzedi).

I also was on a mad pursuit to "fix myself" when I first hopped on stimulant medications. I felt like Adderall was the key that unlocked my brain and I became voracious for information in the name of self-improvement. There was something ironic about this endeavor, I was gulping down Adderall after Adderall to be able to do all this self-improvement stuff to be able to be a better, smarter, and happier person in society.. only to lose all my friends and close relationships in the process. What the hell is the point of learning all this shit if you're just sitting on it while cooped up in the house being all anti-social? 

Now, I was able to completely empathize with your hesitation to quit when you brought up the possibility of 'no longer being intelligent'. That thought alone kept me on the medication for the last 2-3 years. Sure my body was deteriorating on Adderall, I understood that, but I didn't want to lose my active intelligence that Adderall seemed to unlock. And I bold-faced the word seemed for a reason, because I strongly believe, in the vast majority of users and in the vast number of circumstances, Adderall provides the FEELING of increased intelligence, but doesn't actually raise your IQ to any significant effect. This is especially true in the long-run when the years of poor sleep and poor lifestyle eventually takes its inevitable toll. 

I quit Adderall in the middle of one of the most difficult and more relevant semesters in graduate school. I couldn't stand the person I became on Adderall when it came to interacting with other people. I became socially avoidant and just plain fuckin' awkward around everyone. I went from talking someone's ear off when the medication was peaking to wanting to be by myself in the corner when it wore off. Interestingly enough, my test grades were not significantly different. In fact, my test grades actually increased by 3-5 points! I know that may not constitute as "significant", but I found it interesting. After being off Adderall this long, I can tell you that it didn't make me smarter.. it just made me feel smarter. Right now, I'm a LOT more connected with what I know and what I don't know and need to research versus being absolutely confident on anything and everything on Adderall (wrongly so in many cases). 

I still love to learn new shit, though I may not be as obsessive with doing so as I was when I was on Adderall. You will still want to keep learning about new cool, exciting things once you quit Adderall, trust me. It may be difficult early on in the recovery, but you'll get there. You can't go on like this. Quit now, you haven't been taking it that long. You will bounce back quicker if you quit now vs waiting for 4 additional years like I did. And yes, I mean quit taking it altogether. Tapering is fine if you wish to do it that way, but as I've said in my previous post, if you're taking Adderall for a specific purpose in mind (in this case, you definitely are), then you will not be able to sustain taking a fixed dose over a long period of time, because the effects will wear off through tolerance and you will need to keep increasing your dosage till it's out of control..

 

Best of luck, reach out to me if you need anything. 

[An Update And The Word I Fear The Most]

So it has been a while since I've last posted here and feel like I should provide an update before I venture into my post. Firstly and most significantly, I've graduated physical therapy school and passed my state board exam - I'm officially a doctor of physical therapy! Studying for the state board exam was an arduous endeavor, especially having to shore up my natural motivation to get myself to study for 5+ hours a day. This was a pivotal moment for me. I believe we all have this "thing" in the depths of our minds we believe could shatter our convictions and have us making that familiar phone call to schedule an appointment with our psychiatrist to load-up on more Adderall. Well, this was my "thing". I didn't think I had it in me to take on this 5.5 hour, 250 question examination that would ultimately determine my occupational fate. However, this was not an unfamiliar feeling throughout my recovery.. this feeling of inadequacy, this feeling of wanting/needing "more".

"More".. the one word that still looms over my head even so far into recovery (which is 16 months at this point of time.. I think?). "More".. the one word that constantly and consistently attempts to thwart my efforts of living a life stimulant-free. "More".. the one word that I fear the most. And it couldn't have such a profound effect on my psyche without it's equally insidious and nefarious cousin "not enough" tunneling through my mind at every perceived impasse in my life. I thought earning my doctorate degree would finally prove to myself that I am adequate and can handle anything and everything life throws in my path - and it has to a large degree, don't get me wrong, but there's surprisingly still feelings of needing more to be able to accomplish what I want to do with my life, and this scares me, mostly because there's nothing for me to hide behind now - It's just me. The stimulant fueled masquerade is over, I stand alone, naked and vulnerable. With Adderall, I felt like if I needed to "take it to the next level", I could always pop my pill for that maniacal suit of armor to take on the challenge. It was my silver bullet.. my trump card. 

So.. why haven't I gone back to Adderall? You might be wondering now. Well, let me put it succinctly and directly, it's all bullshit, that's why. Adderall never took me to "the next level", it only provided the feeling of mental fortitude, but inevitably and invariably led to disastrous outcomes in the long run. Besides, whoever said vulnerability was a bad thing? Being vulnerable, that is, digging deep down and allowing the real "me" to be exposed to the world has only led to favorable outcomes. My relationships are stronger than ever, I'm able to connect with people in ways I've never thought possible, and my cynical sense of humor is coming back, something I've missed very much about myself. Also, paradoxically, the word "more" is also a reason why I haven't.. no.. will never go back to Adderall. For me (and very very likely everyone on this discussion board), a "controlled dose" AKA taking Adderall as prescribed by your physician is not an option. Why? Because if you're taking it for some purpose in mind (being more social, feeling smarter, getting more done etc.), then a fixed dose will not deliver what you desire for any extended amount of time. You will always need MORE. 

 

Anyway, I hope this post made sense. Yes, I have further to go in my recovery, but I've made some incredible strides and do not regret quitting in the slightest sense. I mean, this was, hands down, the best decision I've made in my life. If I were to label the first year with one word, I would call it the "recovery" phase. If I were to do the same with second year of recovery (thus far), I would label it the "adaptation" phase, because what i'm doing now is learning to adapt to life as "me" again. And though not everyday is great, at least I know life isn't passing me by as I dig myself deeper into the throes of addiction. Thank you for reading. 

 

-Dr. Duffman :-p

 

[Day 65 Severe Depression Kicks In]

On phone at work, but wanted to express to you real quick that what you're experiencing isn't some grand realization that you're worthless or the world would be a better place if you didn't exist. Rather, it's your brain's chemistry attempting to correct itself. At this stage in recovery, you're guaranteed to experience wild fluctuations in mood. Whatever you're experiencing, it will soon pass. Trust me. I was there many months ago. 

[Hello, I'm Mr. 75%]

Pleased to meet you! 

Although, I guess it would be more accurate to say 'Pleased to be reacquainted with you!'...... Don't remember me huh? I'm you! Or at least 3/4's you. You, the ever present self. The only YOU there has ever been and ever will be.

I'm must confess, I'm mildly offended I didn't receive a warmer welcoming. I just passed Mr. 60% walking in. I've never had the opportunity of meet Mr. 60% personally, I mean, only one of us can be YOU at a time. But word has it, he's a bore! Stumbling over his words when conversing with others, frequently losing this train of thought mid-sentence, inability to focus on anything longer than the maximum allotted characters in a twitter message.. a truly uninspired being!

I see some familiar faces on this forum. There's Mrs. 25%.. Mrs. 50%... Oh Look! There's Mr. 10%, y'ouch! That was a rough one for you, remember that? All Mr. 10% wanted to do was lie on the couch, having one existential crisis after the other. You see? Relatively speaking, I'm a blessing!

..Oh I know *rolls eyes*.. EVERYONE wants to see Mr./Mrs. 100% walk through that door. Everyone on this forum keeps talking about how wonderful Mr./Mrs. 100% is and how much they miss them and how desperately they want Mr./Mrs. 100% back into their life.. Was it really that great though? I mean, wasn't it Mr. 100% that suggested to you to take that pill that allowed those psychos Mr. 150% and even Mr. 200% in? Yeah, those maniacal basket cases can handle.. or at least are convinced they can handle.. just about anything, but what happens when you run a system at 2x the output over an extended period of time? The system eventually falters, and those two disappear for good. Then Mr. 10% takes ahold of you, and to the couch you go!

Anyway, I'm not here to place blame on you.. or.. or anyone else for that matter. The important thing is we meet again! I mean, we had some good times in the past. Remember 8 years ago when you were sick but decided to go into work anyway? I handled it just fine! Hell, I can even masquerade as Mr. 100% from afar. It'll take an in-depth conversation, public speaking or.. uhh.. or a big big test in order to even notice I'm not Mr. 100%!......

....You don't seem satisfied... well, no matter, because I'm all you got right now!

How long am I staying? Well that all depends on one person, you. Will you keep going? Or are you going to give in to the impulse of taking that pill again to entice Mr. 200% back into your life? Word on the street has it that Mr. 200% is gone. Sure he's accessible to other people who haven't taken the pill yet, but he's nothing more than a memory to you and all the others here that have been duped into thinking that taking that pill and letting that psycho in was a good idea in the first place. Yeah... Mr. 100% is still around. He's even beginning to contemplate wanting back in. Even though I seem to get no respect around here, I'm a good guy and I will hang around till Mr. 100% decides to come back in. Besides, even when Mr. 100% comes back in, we still get to hang out when you get poor sleep or have fallen ill. Until then, it's just you and me, pal!

 

Anyway, just hit my 1 year mark! As you can tell from above, I'm about 75% where I want to be. 

 

 

[The +2 Year Mark =,]

21 hours ago, Frank B said:

I'd like to say your dead wrong it gets so much better. But you know what fuck you might just be right it's 14 months for me and I still work like a 90 year old man. Sure I can hit the gym etc be fine. But when it comes down to bust your ass earn a hards day pay im truely pathetic. I've done everything on here eat right, take supplements, exersize and it's still the same. Fucking sick of it people say keep going etc but no ones donating to my family to keep me going nor should they. Fact is we all need to work some harder then others and if we can't do that how can we survive? I haven't been honest on here for awhile try to stay positive for people trying to quit but know what I don't have much to be positive about and no one has a fucking solution besides keep sticking it out 2, 3 , 5 years when does it end ?!?!! I really don't know what to do my mindset at this point if I go back on addy die of a stroke and can give my kids life insurance money they will be better then having me not making money at all because I can't get my act together being a dead beat motherfucker. Something has to change soon I'm at a breaking point with this "recovry" bs fucking heroin addicts recover in less time. Just look at all the other substance abusers when they quit get their life's back then look at us we quit year later we'll I still can't really work hard , I hate work, everyday fucking sucks but I'm sober. This is my rant maybe tomorrow will be a better day but sick of keeping all these feelings bottled up. 

Hey Frank!

I really appreciate you writing this because I too think there tends to be an excessive amount of "It will get better" and "stay positive!"s going around on many posts. This in itself isn't really a bad thing however it tends to make people who need to let their frustrations out and to expose their pain and suffering have a more difficult time having a voice in the conversation. No one wants to seem like a downer in all this, but in reality we all feel like you do in this post at times. We all want each other to succeed in this shit-venture, and to do that, we need space to voice both the positives AND negatives of our experience. I know I'm guilty of this at times. I log on with the intent of expressing my frustrations in order to deliver a message of 'Yeah, you're not alone in your suffering', only to see a lot of positivity and I don't want to be the cause of bringing people down when they're already going through so much shit. So again Frank, thank you.

You and I are in a unique position (or at least I think we are), because we quit multiple medications at once. I quit antidepressants, benzodiazepines, amphetamines (Adderall), and phenibut all within the past 2 years. I have no doubt Adderall has been a major contributor (likely the biggest contributor), however I can't say how much the other medications are contributing in all this. For example, I still can't sleep and it's driving me insane. I've tried EVERYTHING and nothing works. I still feel like I could pass out mid morning -> late afternoon, yet am annoyingly awake at 11PM. Last night, I took a small dose of leftover benzo in order to fall asleep. I relapsed on benzos, and I can't say I regret it because I felt pretty good today. I'm pretty sure I can control this because I originally needed the benzo to help ease my Adderall crash, so I'm hoping I don't become dependent on this shit. There's a phenomenon called "PAWS", standing for Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome. This phenomenon very possibly true for Adderall, but is most definitely and verifiably true with opioids (pain meds). Keep in mind you might be experiencing PAWS from your pain medication use. The shitty thing about PAWS is it can last several years (~2 years, but I've read stories where it has lasted for 5!). I'm not sure if that's an encouraging thing to hear, but it may provide insight as to why you're feeling the way you are feeling. 

[The +2 Year Mark =,]

So this is where I believe referring to traumatic brain injury timelines is apropos, because I strongly believe we gave ourselves chemical brain injuries as opposed to, say, traumatic brain injuries (e.g. bumping your head) or ischemic brain injuries (stroke) by taking massive doses of Adderall. Now, healing times are very relevant to the conversation because healing from brain trauma is something that happens over the course of many months (usually a few years!), so being back to baseline would be incorrect in this instance. However, even if my hypothesis is wrong and our brains have absolutely no trauma, neuroplastic changes in the brain most definitely occurred while we were taking Adderall, and that takes a long time to correct; certainly longer than a month. When you take in a substance that influences neurotransmitters over the course of an extended period of an time, your brain adapts to this influx and begins to halt natural production of the said neurotransmitter, in this case, dopamine. In addition, our brain is constantly rewiring itself based on what we do to it or how we use it. Your brain's wiring was most definitely altered by using Adderall, no question. So your brain rewired itself to adapt to taking massive doses of Adderall, then you cease taking Adderall. The 'readapting phase', we'll call it, of your brain rewiring itself to accommodate a life without ingesting Adderall takes time, and there is no definitive timeline for this unfortunately. In all actuality, it never ends, your brain constantly changes itself based on your life experiences. You hinted towards this by saying 'They become more active and productive few months later because they were forced to function without adderall. Those tasks eventually become a habit. This is a result of training the brain, not really relief from withdrawal symptom' but then came to the almost assuredly incorrect conclusion that your brain is back to baseline because you're a month free. Adderall's half-life is ~11 hours, so it exited your system within the first day of quitting, but the changes it made over the course of you and I taking it remain. 

What I'm getting at is you shouldn't have this fixed view of "Well, I guess I'm healed as much as I'm gonna be, so that's that", because 1 month off is nothing. Your brain still has a long way to go to return to its baseline. And no, I'm not romanticizing your baseline as something that it's not, I even wrote a post about that topic (below). Keep going and don't give in. From what it sounds like, your addiction is beckoning to you to go back on Adderall. It will try convince you you're nothing without it, it will try convince you you're as good as you're gonna get, it will try to convince you you'll return to superhuman levels of cognition and energy if you just take it again.. all of which, is bullshit.