Performing in Elite Academia Without Adderall? Confused about this site.

[Stanford Law]

Upon reading the various articles on this site, the general narrative seems to be that quitting Adderall is hard, you'll have to force yourself to study/work, etc.; however, there seems to be a dearth of info regarding coping with the new weaker cognition.

See, I can do without Adderall in my life so long as I need not face something very intellectually taxing such as law school. For me, not only do I have the inability to focus and concentrate, but reading and comprehending convoluted and complex legal/philosophical rhetoric is virtually impossible without stimulants--I just can't understand anything.

My question is for those of you that are in academia and have quit Adderall--how have you remained competitive in your respective programs? Is this something that is possible?

[FALCON]

Yoo hi Mr.ore Mrs. Stanford I am reading your post I want to say you got some fancy vocabulary there I had to look at a dictionary to translate most of your words reading your post trying to decipher what the hell you are trying to say speak in plan English next time. I only have a high school degree. Well here are my thoughts in my basic non intellect language O yes I forgot I did Go to college the name of the school was fuckin school of hard knocks yes it was a real education and a real school. Her is my question to you my brother or sister I suspect you are a brother whey don’t intellect people put more information on there profile its beyond me. What are you all hiding the facts about your self its not only you my brother its 98%of the members what am trying to express’s is be your self you are not being judged. So if you cant get thru sandfert U without adderall How the hell are you going to perform in a court room will you still need adderall to perform your lawyer tasks. Or will you not need adderall anymore after you your intellect law school. Which is it with adderall or without adderall. It sounds to me like you will need the stimulation for life am I right or am I wrong. Sorry for being so hard on you my brother I jest am trying to open your eyes trying to say in my own basic language get off the shit before you get to stanfert because if you are unable to get thru school without adderall you currently will not get thru a law trial without addearll see my point go for it the naturall way if you can. Don’t Push your self thru law school if you need adderall to do it with. I suspect you are trying to live up to someone’s expectations for you think hard about law school its not for everyone so don’t beet up on your self if you think you cant get thru law school without this evil drug. My brother adderall will fuck you at the end and adderall will win the battle it will take your soul away from you sooner or latter the longer you take adderall the more your tolerance to the drug increases it’s the way it is. I hop you don’t think I’m a ass I’m jest trying to clean your reading classes so you can see a bit better If you would like to give me a privet e mail fell free to do so. Hopefully your friend 24 days clean yes baby finally having ok day THE FALCON

[Stanford Law]

Yoo hi Mr.ore Mrs. Stanford I am reading your post I want to say you got some fancy vocabulary there I had to look at a dictionary to translate most of your words reading your post trying to decipher what the hell you are trying to say speak in plan English next time. I only have a high school degree. Well here are my thoughts in my basic non intellect language O yes I forgot I did Go to college the name of the school was fuckin school of hard knocks yes it was a real education and a real school. Her is my question to you my brother or sister I suspect you are a brother whey don’t intellect people put more information on there profile its beyond me. What are you all hiding the facts about your self its not only you my brother its 98%of the members what am trying to express’s is be your self you are not being judged. So if you cant get thru sandfert U without adderall How the hell are you going to perform in a court room will you still need adderall to perform your lawyer tasks. Or will you not need adderall anymore after you your intellect law school. Which is it with adderall or without adderall. It sounds to me like you will need the stimulation for life am I right or am I wrong. Sorry for being so hard on you my brother I jest am trying to open your eyes trying to say in my own basic language get off the shit before you get to stanfert because if you are unable to get thru school without adderall you currently will not get thru a law trial without addearll see my point go for it the naturall way if you can. Don’t Push your self thru law school if you need adderall to do it with. I suspect you are trying to live up to someone’s expectations for you think hard about law school its not for everyone so don’t beet up on your self if you think you cant get thru law school without this evil drug. My brother adderall will fuck you at the end and adderall will win the battle it will take your soul away from you sooner or latter the longer you take adderall the more your tolerance to the drug increases it’s the way it is. I hop you don’t think I’m a ass I’m jest trying to clean your reading classes so you can see a bit better If you would like to give me a privet e mail fell free to do so. Hopefully your friend 22 days clean yes baby finally having ok day THE FALCON

FALCON,

I appreciate your lucid words of wisdom regarding Adderall. I'm 23 years old and male--you were right about my gender by the way.

You are completely right about the fact that if needing Adderall is required for getting through law school, working as a lawyer will probably require similar stimulant induced stimulation. That is something I've been trying not to think of, as my hope is that somehow I will develop a natural coping method or even possibly outgrow it.

The fact is, I have no other option than to complete law school as it is the only avenue that will allow me to make a comfortable living for myself. Falcon, you are also right about me trying to conform to other people's expectations; however, I've come to far down this road to turn back now, I'm afraid.

If others have academic related experiences, I'd love to hear it.

Falcon, congrats on 22 days clean! I hope to be where you are before Adderall really fucks me over.

[FALCON]

MR. STANFORD Thank you for your kind rebuttal you went easy on me. I do appreciate it and you have my respect. Don’t be afraid my brother fear is a very strong emotion. Fear must be concord in order to become successful in your guest to have money successful folks and our brothers and sisters in arms have trained to dismiss there fears. Fear is not a weakness of character do not be scared my friend.

Success will come to you in one form or another it depends on how hungry you are for it sounds like you are hungry for success so you will be successful in what ever you do this is what my intuition tells me. Jest keep your options’ open I jest feel your fear of getting thru law school will beat you up and the adderall you need will rob your soul. Last comment I have Ben a poor man and I have bin a rich man making 250.000 a year for most of my carrier I am back to being a poor man regarding to wealth or how much money I have accumulated butt I am content see Iv Ben on both sides of the street. Success comes in deferent forms Helping your fellow man without any monumental return is a successful . I hope my point is taken .

I guess we are now friends thank you THE FALCON

[KatieK1986]

Mr. Stanford, I was on Adderall all throughout graduate school. I took it during my full-time job during the day and to help me focus at classes at night/complete my work. All I can say is this: I got through high school and undergrad without the drug (okay, I had Adderall a few times to get me through some tough projects during my undergrad). If I could manage life without it then, I can do it now. When did you start taking Adderall?

Katie K

[Cassie]

I agree with falcon. If you need adderall to get through law school, you are going to need it to be a lawyer as well. I think it's going to be harder to quit once you're in your job, because you won't know how to do that job without it, versus school where you've presumably spent years of your life not on speed. Also, if you don't truly love law school/the law profession, you should probably get out now. I've known many miserable lawyers.

[ashley6]

My counselor brought this up to me, and I've found it to be so true.

state-dependent learning

n.

Learning associated with a specific state of sleep or wakefulness or with a chemically altered state, such that the learned information cannot be recalled or used unless the subject is restored to the state that existed when learning first occurred.

I think this is why it's a struggle to bounce when you've learned while being on adderall. It's retraining your brain how to think in an unaltered state, after quitting. I agree with Cassie and Falcon. I highly doubt it will become easier to quit once your out of law school.

[highonlife]

Stanford, I can relate quite well to your situation since I am a 22-year-old pre-med student. I quit Adderall about 5 months ago and it has been tough to say the very least. I am doing great in school, but my MCAT score took a major hit because my endurance was that of a second grade child. I am working to get my MCAT score up, but it takes a lot of righteous effort; I can't just pop a pill. I wish I had more encouraging things to say as far as academics, but it's just tough. My life is better though.

[Stanford Law]

Mr. Stanford, I was on Adderall all throughout graduate school. I took it during my full-time job during the day and to help me focus at classes at night/complete my work. All I can say is this: I got through high school and undergrad without the drug (okay, I had Adderall a few times to get me through some tough projects during my undergrad). If I could manage life without it then, I can do it now. When did you start taking Adderall?

Katie K

Hi Katie,

After barely making it through high school, I ended up seeing a Psychiatrist the summer before starting at a crappy local college, and he diagnosed me with ADHD & prescribed me with Adderall. Adderall made me an academic superstar, and allowed me to be one of the few junior transfers to Yale.

So, unlike yourself, where you actually got through a portion of your education successfully without Adderall--I have not and am afraid the level of intellectual strength I need for what I'm doing is not possible without stimulants.

My mother wants me to quit school and work a retail job as she is afraid of my health degenerating (she's a bit histrionic at times); however, there is no way I could go from Yale and Stanford Law to minimum wage retail...I just cannot do it.

I agree with falcon. If you need adderall to get through law school, you are going to need it to be a lawyer as well. I think it's going to be harder to quit once you're in your job, because you won't know how to do that job without it, versus school where you've presumably spent years of your life not on speed. Also, if you don't truly love law school/the law profession, you should probably get out now. I've known many miserable lawyers.

I see what you guys are saying, and in my heart I know it's true, but I just don't want to accept it. Maybe I can practice an easy type of law without Adderall.

My counselor brought this up to me, and I've found it to be so true.

state-dependent learning

n.

Learning associated with a specific state of sleep or wakefulness or with a chemically altered state, such that the learned information cannot be recalled or used unless the subject is restored to the state that existed when learning first occurred.

I think this is why it's a struggle to bounce when you've learned while being on adderall. It's retraining your brain how to think in an unaltered state, after quitting. I agree with Cassie and Falcon. I highly doubt it will become easier to quit once your out of law school.

That anecdote is very accurate IMO. Often times I'll be on Adderall days leading up to an exam and the day after the exam when I'm off of Adderall--I can't recall anything...literally.

Stanford, I can relate quite well to your situation since I am a 22-year-old pre-med student. I quit Adderall about 5 months ago and it has been tough to say the very least. I am doing great in school, but my MCAT score took a major hit because my endurance was that of a second grade child. I am working to get my MCAT score up, but it takes a lot of righteous effort; I can't just pop a pill. I wish I had more encouraging things to say as far as academics, but it's just tough. My life is better though.

Thank you for your reply--I can totally relate. When I was studying for the LSAT, being on Adderall made it so incredibly fun to study, my brain was on-fire, and ended up getting a 177 out of 180. When I tried to study off of Adderall, I just couldn't comprehend the complex logical reasoning need to succeed an my score would take a huge it like 162ish.

But, you said your life has become better...how so? I've become a recluse, studying alone, alienating everyone I know, I spend a good 3-4 hours high on Adderall...and the rest of the day crashing and being paranoid about my heart-beat. I just want to be normal and get a girlfriend, have friends, work-out, etc.

I guess I'm just really afraid of losing everything I've worked for....

[highonlife]

Stanford, you are in the right place and I can relate very well to your situation. I absolutely had to quit Adderall because it was robbing me of so many things. I could go on and on about why Adderall sucks and no one should take it, but just know that I had the same fears as you. I had to sacrifice a lot of things. I mean A LOT of things. I KNOW that I could have abused Adderall and gotten the MCAT score I wanted and I would be starting medical school next fall. Just like all my tool bag pre-med friends. The difference is I wanted to obtain something without Adderall. Like you, I was unsure of myself and didn't prove much of anything without Adderall. So I decided to take a year off in order to train my brain to do what it needs for medical school WITHOUT Adderall. You seem like a very smart guy and you know as well as anyone, you are not going to magically become mentally sharp when you decide to quit Adderall. You have become dependent. I can tell my cognitive abilities are starting to reach where they were when I was on Adderall, but I still have a ways to go. Just know that you can do it because you will still want the same things whenever you quit Adderall; however, there is no motivation and you will see how big your balls are. I used to pull all-nighters like I was freaking getting paid. The latest I have stayed up is 1 am for a Biomechanics test this semester. Your study techniques and everything will have to change and that will take time, but you can do it. You just have to be willing to sacrifice whatever it takes.

I would love to say more about my story and why I think quitting Adderall has saved my life and made me a better person, but I need to study for a Virology exam tomorrow. God bless.

[FALCON]

Mr stanford my brother slow your ass down you will get thou law school. I will explain how you will accomplish this goal . Right now I need to go out and help a friend so I will give you my game plan later tonight when I get back home Intel then have a cup of herbal tei and chill out the adderall is giving you this anxiety.

Mr stanford before I spend my time on the computer corresponding with you regarding your goals getting thru your law school I need to know one honest thing from you see a native Indian tolled me if you throw a stone into a lake you can see the ripples of the water but can you heir the sound of the stone droping into the water. I will give you the anser latter. My question is are you playing US For attention or are you for REEL please respond trustfully and you will receive the help you are seeking. THE FALCON

If you need tolk to me in privete fell free to email me, you will find email on my profile page.

[FALCON]

HI to mr Stanford I am hopping you are reading these post I jest what to say I herd your call for help. I have a special gift into reading people. learned it at the school of hard knocks. Our members are willing and able to help you jest bee truthful in your posts please do not be embarrassed or even ashamed adderall has the power to make you feel like your superman and also makes a person exaggerate a little please come back to the forum let use try to work out your addiction problem. Our members do not judge so don’t bee scared of that jest be truthful on your post this web site is better then any shrink you can go to out there where real people and the best thing about it you don’t have to pay any money how thus that sound to you Come back to the forum we herd your cry. Yours truly members of quitting adderall FALCON

[Stanford Law]

Thank you for the replies. @FALCON, I do very much want to quit taking Adderall; however, I need to be pragmatic and quit in between semesters--not while finals are getting close.

Stanford, you are in the right place and I can relate very well to your situation. I absolutely had to quit Adderall because it was robbing me of so many things. I could go on and on about why Adderall sucks and no one should take it, but just know that I had the same fears as you. I had to sacrifice a lot of things. I mean A LOT of things. I KNOW that I could have abused Adderall and gotten the MCAT score I wanted and I would be starting medical school next fall. Just like all my tool bag pre-med friends. The difference is I wanted to obtain something without Adderall. Like you, I was unsure of myself and didn't prove much of anything without Adderall. So I decided to take a year off in order to train my brain to do what it needs for medical school WITHOUT Adderall. You seem like a very smart guy and you know as well as anyone, you are not going to magically become mentally sharp when you decide to quit Adderall. You have become dependent. I can tell my cognitive abilities are starting to reach where they were when I was on Adderall, but I still have a ways to go. Just know that you can do it because you will still want the same things whenever you quit Adderall; however, there is no motivation and you will see how big your balls are. I used to pull all-nighters like I was freaking getting paid. The latest I have stayed up is 1 am for a Biomechanics test this semester. Your study techniques and everything will have to change and that will take time, but you can do it. You just have to be willing to sacrifice whatever it takes.

I would love to say more about my story and why I think quitting Adderall has saved my life and made me a better person, but I need to study for a Virology exam tomorrow. God bless.

This is what I was interested in finding out. Your story is similar to mine, except I took Adderall to study for the LSAT, while you had the gumption to quit before taking the MCAT. I'm happy to find out that over time your non-stimulated cognitive abilities have been increasing with practice--this gives me hope.

[FALCON]

Mr stanford thank you for coming back to the forum I am still a little skeptical regarding your story ther are some holes in it that Iv notest. I will give you the benefit of dot for thetime beeing. If you need adderall to get thru you’re semester Ok do what you need to so you can finish your semester with good grads I highly agree with highonlife he had suggested you take a brake take one or to semesters off of law school and regroup reaeset your brain a restar with clear thinking. First of all you need to get clean of adderall it sounds like you will not handle working in law without adderall do you want to take adderall the rest of your life because adderall will raub your soul and make you a zombie then what will you do when you become a zombie how will you practice law believe me it will happen sooner or latter if it already hasn’t turned you into a zombie yet. Take some time off and clear your body from the adderall. As far as your mom is concerned moms are very good in reading there children its part of a women’s DNA.Thay are programmed to take care off there off springs no mater how old you are so the expression mom is always Wright its true. My mom is 80 see still treats me like her little boy

I assume her senses ar correct about your health mom knowes you better then anyone else does . As far as getting a minimal paying job that is nonsense you are to smart guy. can I Make a suggestion I suggest if law is a pation for you then find a temporary job at a law form doing what ever it takes data eatery or research or even bringing coffee to the lawyers do what ever it takes to find that typ of job in a law firm and you will learn the everyday opparaetion of the law business. Then you can go back to school and continue your education if the pation is still there. The answer to the gustion about the old Indian shamon is if you want to hear the stone hit the water you must first clear your mind of all out side extractions. Stanford please be truthful on your story I have a feeling you are not you haven’t yet convientst’ me you are truthful ganing my trust and respect will be your first step in Quitting adderall Welcome back THE FALCON

[highonlife]

Stanford, I understand why you would want to quit at a convenient time, unfortunately there is no such thing. I decided to quit before the MCAT because if there was anything I needed Adderall for it is these ridiculous standardized tests. I knew that if I didn't quit before I was accepted to medical school I wouldn't have the balls to quit. When things got tough and when board exams rolled around, I knew I would be tempted and surrender to the evil pill. I love to learn and I want to enjoy medical school as much as possible. I don't want to make myself miserable which is a guarantee with Adderall. I can see why many pre-meds justify taking Adderall for the MCAT because it is so much different than what one may encounter in medical school, but if I know I can do well on the MCAT without Adderall than I will never be tempted when times get tough in medical school, residency, etc. You should finish finals before quitting; if not you would probably have a freak out. Just know if you do quit, you will eventually have a freak out and have to push through it. It was probably the most crucial milestone for me.

[highonlife]

I am interested in your case because you are the only person on this website that seems to be in a similar situation as I was; however, you are obviously not ready to quit just yet. If you do decide to quit, let us know.

[canes2315]

Hey Stanford. I feel like I am in your shoes and we are kind of going through the same situations. I am a pre med student so my undergrad work is very taxing. I take adderall about 5-6 days a week and i cant stand it, i want to quit very badly. I just feel like my grades will suffer if i quit and i dont know what to do!!!! I know this most likely does not help you but, your not going through this alone!!

[Greg]

I just got my course itinerary for b school and its really really intimidating, but I would rather fail all those classes and fail out of business school than take adderall to pass...

[Defunct]

Stanford Law, I'm not sure if you're tweaking as you are writing or positing to this forum, but you seem smart to me. Other posters have said it and I repeat it - Adderall will make you always feel like you need it (and more so over time) to perform. I worked for over 10 years in Investment Banking and only in the last 2 years started taking it, which is when my career started heading south. Now I have no job and I fear have ruined my professional reputation; all because I can't measure how poorly I was functioning and communicating while I was on adderall.

You are young and so before heading in to the all-encompassing abyss of lack of confidence, followed by adderall, followed by reliance on it for even the most simple tasks and therefore increased lack of confidence, please be kind to yourself and heed the warnings on this excellent site. It's just not worth risking your already-capable-mind and bright future for.

I know, I've been there.

[ADDLawStudent]

I'm in the same situation as you are and I'm glad I found this post. For me, the scariest thought is entering the legal profession without the discipline I need to succeed. I can't imagine trying to write a brief or read a justice's opinion without adderall. I only have a year left so I'm definitely not quitting law school at this point.

I don't know if you still use this website, but any updates on your progress would be great.

[sky]

I'm in the same situation as you are and I'm glad I found this post. For me, the scariest thought is entering the legal profession without the discipline I need to succeed. I can't imagine trying to write a brief or read a justice's opinion without adderall. I only have a year left so I'm definitely not quitting law school at this point.

I don't know if you still use this website, but any updates on your progress would be great.

he'll probably not see what you wrote, hasn't been online since Nov 13th, 2012... and there you can see one of the issues we face-- it's an insidious drug that, as you've said, makes us feel like we can't do without it. I feel for you, I have no idea what college would have been like if adderall had been all the rage like it is now. I am sure that a ton of your peers are also using adderall, I am sure that a ton of working lawyers, judges, cops, DAs, truck drivers, physicians... are all using adderall to make them feel 150%. That only lasts so long. The lucky ones seek help, seek a way out... they can see it's not working, that it's destroying who they are, who they were, their relationships to themselves, their loved ones, their spirit, their god... it turns people into machines with a focus on banal "successes" that really don't matter and probably don't come to fruition anyway... like doing well on exams, getting thru law school, burning thru a 12 hour day... on the surface those goals may be reached, but they are not done with any satisfactory results- they're just "completed", but the end result pretty much sucks ass.

So, there are a bunch of us who keep on keeping on, sticking with it even though we battle the addiction part that calls to us and lies and tells us we can manage it now, etc. If you stick around here ADDLawStudent, you'll see that a lot of folks pass thru, post a bunch for a few days, maybe make it a month, and then bounce. Maybe they get tired of this site and move on, but probably most go back to the adderall.

If you want a way out, you have to keep on not using it. It doesn't make life better, it is an evil concoction that fucks with peoples brains. It slowly turns them into subhuman zombies devoid of feeling and emotion and erases the people they used to be. Get out now, do whatever you have to do to stop using. Just don't take any more pills. A bunch of other people on this site will say the same thing. Even though life may not seem peechy once you stop, it is much better. It is real. You have to deal with it in a way you may not be used to as you don't have the bionic brain that adderall gave you, but it is legit. You can look people in the eyes and know that you are standing on your own two feet, not aided by a drug, those people will fail in their own right, the road doesn't go off into the sunset, it drops out from under your feet if you don't get off of it. So welcome to the forum. We understand your plight.

[Greg]

Just a sidetrack,. What is with ALL these great people who pass through this site and then go back on adderall?? It really shows how much power this drug can have a hold on us..,its sad. Our turnover rate! I guess this is addiction loud and clear. I guess you just have to warn and let them relapse and let them learn the hard way.

[sky]

yes, I always refer to "the lucky ones" who have had some sort of profound enough wake up call to stick around. That's the way they used to talk in the recovery home... those of us who got busted or hit a bottom hard enough to get remanded to the recovery home were "lucky" as we were in a good place, vs those who were still out using and would ultimately not make it... it's sad, but you're right, insidious drug made all the worse by the fact that it is legally attainable and readily available and EVERYWHERE! you can fucking find it everywhere, almost as easily as alcohol or weed. everyone and their fucking mother has it nowadays. And since people are prescribed it, it's easy to keep getting...

I'm to the point now where I'm jaded and cynical, I can't look at every new Tell Your Story post and think they're going to stick around for too long... it's sad, but that's how I feel. It's like I feel like I can tell who's just passing thru. I think it's the lurkers who are probably the best off- listening rather than talking, hearing and studying rather than just bla bla bla whoa is me and then bounce cuz they can't handle the discomfort of quitting.... another thing they used to say is "take the cotton out of your ears and put it in your mouth..." shut the fuck up and listen.

[Cat]

Just chiming in to say I'm still here. It is Day 75 or so. Doing great! In fact, just took on a big non-work project (think: planning a really big party where all your friends and family are in attendance ) and am not at all scared about doing it without adderall.

In case this is relevant to other people who think they need adderall for work or busy lifestyles: I also thought adderall was necessary to be a top performer and meet high expectations of others at my job/life. It had the opposite effect. It was good for an hour or two of feeling good/motivated each morning, then followed by hours of hyperfocusing on the wrong things, crushing anxiety about things I didn't get done, crashing and drinking too much, and not even caring about any of it.

[Motivation_Follows_Action]

yes, I always refer to "the lucky ones" who have had some sort of profound enough wake up call to stick around. That's the way they used to talk in the recovery home... those of us who got busted or hit a bottom hard enough to get remanded to the recovery home were "lucky" as we were in a good place, vs those who were still out using and would ultimately not make it... it's sad, but you're right, insidious drug made all the worse by the fact that it is legally attainable and readily available and EVERYWHERE! you can fucking find it everywhere, almost as easily as alcohol or weed. everyone and their fucking mother has it nowadays. And since people are prescribed it, it's easy to keep getting...

I'm to the point now where I'm jaded and cynical, I can't look at every new Tell Your Story post and think they're going to stick around for too long... it's sad, but that's how I feel. It's like I feel like I can tell who's just passing thru. I think it's the lurkers who are probably the best off- listening rather than talking, hearing and studying rather than just bla bla bla whoa is me and then bounce cuz they can't handle the discomfort of quitting.... another thing they used to say is "take the cotton out of your ears and put it in your mouth..." shut the fuck up and listen.

I know how you feel, but sometimes I really miss people who kind of go away after a while. I miss Falcon. I miss Heather (anyone seen her around here recently?). I had a dream the other night about Emm, remember her from Michigan? Krax, and many others. Sometimes I wish even if people had relapsed they'd come here for the support, because that's when it's needed most. Support and accountability.