quit-once

Happy Boxing Day ZK! Could you please tell me about the significance of Canada's Boxing Day holiday? Is it for boxng up all those useless gifts and holiday decorations?

Hi, Kathleen- I remember that you and Ashley quit around the same time and I often wondered how you were doing. I am so glad to hear from you again and that you are doing well. You just said a couple of things that I completely agree with. Adderall does mask depression and that is what I used it for too. What I didn't realize, while using, was that it actually made my depression much worse by going up and down with my dosages. Congrats for kicking the cigs. I, too, kicked the cigs about the same as quitting Adderall and I believe that was actually the easiest time to make those big, life-long lifestyle changes. I too associate Adderall with cigs and having them coupled in my mind creates the slippery slope starting with either drug which could lead to a full blown relapse if I fucked up and did either one of them. Cigs can cloud your mind with poor judgment. Nicotine drives my speed train. I put that train in a museum about 2.5 years ago. Thanks for the update and good luck continuing with your recovery!

careful...that is a curse word around here. I almost deleted your post and flagged you as a spammer.

what did you do about those 12 students who cheated?

I still desire a cig once in a while. I wouldn't call it a craving but I must acknowledge the desire. It goes away if I don't entertain the thought. Love the smoke, hate the habit. And like any other addiction, you can't have one without the other. I am not as strong as you, InRecovery, and I am still really tempted when I am around people who smoke. I love the smell of tobacco. It has been 2.5 years without any nicotine after 30+ years of smoking. Abstinence is the only way for me to continue. Ashley, I got a great chuckle out of your last comment "its hard to talk about smoking and running in the same post". How true.

Until now I had lost all faith in higher education having any kind of a moral compass. That story really bothered me too because I thought the teacher just didn't give a shit if they were all cheating. So, did you get an A in that class? I believe that using Adderall for academic gain, whether one is ADD or not, is not ethical. I see it exactly the same way as I view those "role model" athletes using steroids. Steroids enhance physical performance, and speed enhances mental performance. Both put the non-users at a significant disadvantage when it comes to competition.

A 4.0 in grad school is as good as it gets, InRecovery. Congrats. Last year you were concerned about grad school business ethics and how community cheating could impact the grade curve. Any more experiences with that? Also, how do you feel about people using Adderall as a performance-enhancing drug, like athletes using steroids, for academic gain?

Yep, you did get spammed! Seems like the casting spammer is making the rounds again this morning.

I do not have much knowledge about Lyme disease but I am aware the effects can last for years after the initial onset of the disease. I also heard on NPR there was a new treatment or vaccine for it. The vaccine? might not help you but have you asked your doctor lately or googled treatments for Lyme? One bad event, in your case a tick bite, can really fuck things up for a long time. I can totally relate to you wanting to get off the Adderall and live a normal life. Lots of us around here have overcome our addictions to speed, but it becomes much more difficult when you have a disease or auto-immune condition to deal with as well. I really hope you can find solutions to these issues so you can move on with your life.

MY 2013 YEAR-END CLEANSE DEC 21-30 When I first posted this topic two years ago, I had every intention of undertaking this exercise. But I was only six months into recovery and frankly, I just couldn't muster the strength to go any length of time without eating food. At 10.5 months into my recovery, I did attempt a full ten day cleanse, and ended it after eight days. It was after that cleanse that I took up yoga and developed some very health eating habits that are still with me. My pill cleanse in September taught me that some of my supplements that were messing with my sleep and digestion. I am feeling the need to detoxify once again. I have developed a fairly high caffeine tolerance that I would like to dial back. I have been craving bad foods more often, and although I have mostly stayed away from the sugar and flour I have still been eating too much food coupled with too little exercise. I have gained about ten pounds in the last two months, and while that does not sound like a lot, it is for me. I am 5'9'' with a light to medium frame and ten pounds makes the difference between feeling fit and being fat. When I have to keep my pants on with a belt, I am too fat. Today I weighed 174 lbs. I plan to donate $20 for each day of my cleanse to our local food bank, because I realize there are a lot of people who are hungry and not by choice. I am about to make my first glass of lemonade consisting of the juice from 1/2 lemon, an equal amount (2T) of pure maple syrup, a dash of red pepper and a cup of purified hot water, and this will be my sustenance for the next ten days. I will update this post just like I did in post #3 above throughout my cleanse. Upon completion, I have something fun planned with my friends for the New Years Eve / Day holiday. I can already feel the frontal headache of caffeine withdrawal coming on and I do not expect to have a wonderful day. Day 2; Dec 22: I am glad I posted some thoughts during my last cleanse so I can compare. Day 1 was spent being lazy, hungry, sleeping a lot, questioning why I am doing this, and entertaining a headache. The notable differences between yesterday and day 1 of my cleanse 1.5 years ago was that I did not have the muscle and joint pain and the headache was less severe this time. The headache has lessened today, but I still feel it. I have not been as hungry or in a down mood, either. I got some light housekeeping work done, and I didn't need a nap. This evening a neighbor brought a plate of X-mas goodies to me so I thanked them and promptly bagged it up and put it into the freezer (I was tempted but did not eat a crumb). I really do not like how the lemonade drink tastes but I can tolerate it, I guess. Tomorrow is a work day, and I am grateful I can work from home. Day 4, Dec 24: I'm done. That didn't last long. I got invited to a friends X-Mas party tomorrow featuring monster king crab claws and ribeye steaks. Couldn't pass it up. I made some fresh orange juice to prepare my stomach for solid food then made a pot of fresh veggie stew. This time, I REALLY hated the taste of that lemonade - maybe I just got some sour lemons or who knows what but I was only having about 4-6 drinks per day and got totally bored, depressed, and lacked energy at all levels. This morning I weighed about 170 and I know I will gain it all back tomorrow. Oh well.....at least I feel like my pipes are clean.

do you feel any guilt for all those bad food choices?

Very profound. Is that a Justin original phrase?

Yes,........what he said! Way to Go Ashley!

Yes, it does help you to MORTGAGE YOUR FUTURE.

Last year, one of our members suggested the following simple exercise to calm yourself down: With each breath, say or think to yourself "Breath in Peace.........breath out Release" At least three times. It works - I use it whenever I get scatterbrained, confused or angry.

Cassie, you are one of us "regulars" whose posts I read no matter whether the discussion thread interests me or not. I usually learn something interesting or gain some valuable insight by reading whatever it is you have written. Two years is a big milestone, and I agree with you that we are still not done with recovery. I am happy for your two years of freedom, and thanks for helping me get started practicing yoga.

Congrats on your decision to quit and welcome to the forums. Nobody you work with needs to know that you took (not take) Adderall. The symptoms of Adderall withdrawal and influenza are pretty similar, so it is not a big stretch to say you have the flu if you just can't function at work. That should be good for a few days off to begin your recovery. And if you still feel out of sorts by the time you have to go back to work, well, that was a really bad case of the flu and it knocked the hell out of you. Just showing up and trying to do your job will be good enough. They have only known you for a few months so anything is possible. If you really need chemical energy, caffeine will likely be your best friend. Really. Anything that is not a hardcore stimulant drug will help you through the times of low energy and low brain power. Do Whatever it takes to stay off all stimulant drugs. Do you have a long term plan for quitting? Do you have pills stashed? Are you willing to sever your supply channel? Are there consequences if you relapse? Good luck and I wish you much success in your quitting endeavor!

Awesome! I kicked the cigs within a month of quitting Adderall. I read somewhere that quitting smoking success was enhanced when you quit something else and make those big lasting lifestyle changes. I found that to be true for me.

I actually did convince myself that I was an ADD case and always had been. I am not a very good liar and I had to lie to myself in order to lie to the doctor. Funny thing is, by the time I decided to quit, I had developed moderate to severe ADHD from the Adderall abuse. Sure glad that went away after I quit. I do believe it is a real condition and I am sorry for those who are affected by it. So to address Kramer mojo's question, I do believe that very small dosses of Adderall are effective treatment for ADD. I also believe that high doses of stimulants will stimulate just about everybody, ADD or not. But once you have come to abuse the meds there is no turning back to "therapeutic" levels of stimulants. Like the alcoholic who can't have Ny-quill.

Do you have a plan to quit for the long term? What if the T treatment does not work? I too suffered with muscle and joint pain while using Adderall. I took about a year after quitting to quit feeling "old", although I felt measurable improvement after just a few weeks. Regular yoga practice really helps. Energy levels and motivation were the last things to return for me. The long term impacts of testosterone therapy are relatively unknown. Long term quitting Adderall , I believe, is a better solution to chronic undiagnosed illnesses and conditions.

same here

I would like to add an amusing doctor story to this great discussion: I chose my doctor out of the phone book. The local hospital placed an ad on the back cover of the phone directory. It had all the doctors in town that have an association with the hospital, which is pretty much all of them. The ad featured the doctor's photo and a description of their practice or specialty. So I looked at their pictures and picked out the one I thought looked like he would prescribe me Adderall. Sure enough, the one I chose granted my request and started me out on 5 mg. A few months later, I told him that 10 mg worked much better than 5mg twice daily and requested an increase in dosage. I also told him that I only took pills on the weekends. To my surprise, that pissed him off and he chided me for taking more than prescribed, and not every day. He begrudgingly gave me the dose I requested, but never granted another increase. He had no clue that I had other sources and that I was actually bingeing on 100-150 mg per day 3-4 days per week. Although I had some initial blood work done, I never saw this doctor for anything else besides Adderall (but he did give me Chantix for kicking the cigs). I had an annual physical with him about six months after I quit. I told him that I quit cold turkey because I didn't like the feeling of addiction. He said fine, and if you ever need it again, you can always go back on it. He said since I wasn't on any meds I could come back in a year for an annual physical. That was two years ago and I haven't seen him since then. So here is my question: is this a doctor I should feel comfortable going to if I ever need treatment? There really aren't too many adult primary care doctors in the small town (12,000) where I live. I have a pretty neutral opinion on his practice in general.

Motivation and productivity have been slow to return for me too. In fact, I still struggle getting started on the big important tasks, and it seems like the more the work matters the harder it is to get started on it. It is like everything else in recovery, it just gradually gets better or you notice your shortcomings a little less with passing time. I really haven't "craved" Adderall since I quit because I was so glad to be done with that shit. If I find myself in the same room with others using stimulants, I will leave the room. (and I have done this) If I ever found a pill I would flush that fucker so quick.....because I may have an irrational impulsive urge to pop it just because it is there. Amazing that I have never found a wayward pill anywhere. I am anti-Adderall but I could still be tempted by other stimulants, so I must always remain vigilant. Thank God my addiction ran its full course and I grew to hate the drug I once worshiped. I will always be aware that I cannot have even one pill without the return of the addiction. I view my relationship with Adderall just as I would view a relationship with an ex girlfriend whom I will never see again (she left the country), of as a dead loved one or pet who is never coming back. Dead is dead and life is for living. A drug or alcohol addiction is not living - it is a miserable existence.

I had a bout of insomnia last summer and I took it and it helped me to fall asleep and sleep all night. It is supposed to help your mood too. It contains melatonin, tryptophan (the protein in turkey meat that makes you sleepy) and phenylalanine (which gets made into serotonin) and some other things. There was a post in the supplements forum on 5 HTP about a year ago. You can get it at any supplement shop - I saw it at Whole Foods last weekend. I bet GNC has it too. I am glad your insomnia is getting better, Jon. If you have any 5 HTP left, it might be worth another try at a reduced dosage.

Butt Cold?? Is that a Minnesota term?