idontcare Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Hi everyone, I've been lurking for quite a while. I've set out on a quest to quit amphetamine a handful of times in the past and this site has been my motivation. What worries me is that I may be one of those people that has a lame frontal lobe, requiring a steady dose of something to stay even remotely interested in most things. I am by no means a tweaker. Sure, I've indulged in higher than prescribed doses and binged on my meds while writing music for days, but that shit really only happened in the beginning and not very frequently. I was originally prescribed 15mg Adderall XR in May, 2013. Tolerance set in and I increased my dose the next month to 15mg IR twice a day. It was a really unnecessary thing to do, as the medication was working as it should have. I just thought that, because the zing and euphoria subsided, it must not be working anymore. I had my occasional fun, usually the day I got my script filled, taking a double dose and just focusing on writing/recording music. I'd occasionally stay up for 48 hours, 72 a few times. That shit started to wear on my quickly, amplifying my previously mild Tic disorder to intense heights. I knew it wasn't sustainable but I figured I'd ask to be switched to dexedrine since it lacked the Levo-Amphetamine portion that Adderall had. I decided to start using responsibly with 20mg dextroamphetamine, which I did for the most part. But even at the lower dosage on the new medication, I still felt a certain depersonalization and dissatisfaction with life. I tried to quit but the lethargy pushed me right back to the pill. But I had a plan this time. I purposely sabotaged myself by having my psychiatrist knock me down to 5mg. I told her I just didn't need it that much anymore. So I managed, with my wife's help dispensing medication, to take just 5mg a day, sometimes 7.5mg, rarely 10mg. I felt a lot better but tolerance is always an issue after about a week. I'm just so sick of the cycle of feeling ok for a few weeks on the pills, then feeling like shit for a week to give myself time to upregulate receptors. Then when I go back my tolerance is low enough where it sometimes keeps me up very late or all night, reinforcing my need to take it everyday just to not pass out at work. I don't even know what my purpose is with posting this. I'm 6 days clean now and I even told my psychiatrist I wanted to quit. I'm just worried that I'll never get my motivation back. I feel lethargic and uninspired and though I can't remember exactly how I felt before I started taking amphetamine, I do know I was in a similar state of blah. I had a pretty mild habit and I just don't know how long I should give myself to feel better before deciding if I need pharmacological intervention. I know I definitely picked up a lot of good habits and coping tools while on amphetamine and I'm just hoping that it will be enough for me to not go back. I wish it was more formulaic. I guess that's why I was drawn to amphetamine, so I could control, analyze and formulate everything. I wish it was as simple as on amphetamine for a little over 1.5 years x average of 20mg tapered down to 5mg = ? This whole post is an amazing display of my rigid, unorganized "sober" brain. How embarrassing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlwaysAwesome Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 Welcome!! I think you will find that your story is so familiar to the rest of us. Recently, someone commented that 7 months is still early in my recovery. Energy and motivation will return in time... hang in there and have an energy drink! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassie Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 You get your motivation back but it takes a lot of time. Nothing is wrong with your frontal lobe, other than it's been chemically disrupted and it takes a long time to return to normal. Like you said, it's unsustainable. You're continually creating a greater chemical imbalance in your brain and the addiction gets worse over time. I admire you for telling your doctor. That shows commitment. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted January 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 Thanks for the replies. I do truly believe I have ADHD. Fortunately, I was ahead of the craze in my area where the teachers were recommending students be prescribed meds. My younger brother didn't escape that fate. But whatever, I don't want to be on amphetamine anymore. I can truly attest to the efficacy of tapering. When I tried quitting from 20 mg of dexedrine, I was tired and binge eating for a week. Being on 5 mg for a few months and quitting was way different. I'm on day 7 right now and I woke up at 8 AM without an alarm clock, I have a normal appetite and I'm totally able to get menial things done. The killer is the lack of motivation. I can't even muster the motivation to play video games. Nothing is fun and there is zero passion in my life at the moment. My wife and I are having a baby in 8 months and I need to be clean and present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlwaysAwesome Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 One day at a time...it gets better. I am almost 8 months clean, and I am feeling better. A new thing for me; I don't spend much waking time thinking about Adderall anymore. This is so new, that I don't remember when it happened. I only think about it when I am on this forum and only to reflect on the "cons" and revel in the "pros". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted January 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 I only hope that for me the pros outweigh the cons. Why is it that it's so easy to get hung up on all the negatives of the past, betrayals, burnt bridges, lost friendships and yet, with the destructive things we seem to look back fondly, remembering far more about what it gave us instead of what it took away from us? Pros: It made me wittier. It allowed my thoughts to flow freely like water through an aqueduct instead of like a flood shattering through a dam when unmedicated. It made me more productive and excited about my passions. It made mundane things seem more tolerable. Cons: It made me more arrogant and abrasive. It took away my full potential to love and accept things I can't control. It made me sleep and eat less. Usually a small lunch and a huge dinner just barely equaling 2000 calories. 8 hours of sleep was preferred but 5 or 6 was acceptable as long as I had more dexedrine the next day. This had an impact on my immune system and skin. Not a huge one, but laugh lines got more noticeable. It made my problems seem bigger at the end of the day when my dose wore off. Seems like a pretty balanced list. Hard to say which ones outweigh the others, but obviously I'm here for a reason and I decided to quit for a reason. This is my cycle; getting fed up with feeling on edge and worn down, deciding to quit, feeling lethargic, forgetting how bad I felt, getting back on amphetamine and being like "this isn't so bad, I feel fine," and then weeks later being like "fuck this... this needs to stop." I really wish I journaled my negative experiences. The brain kinda just forgets about a lot of the horror and tricks itself into taking (the illusion of) the path of least resistance. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted February 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 It will be two weeks clean this Thursday. I feel no lack of energy. Quite the opposite, actually. It's fucking annoying. I'm like a 12 year old boy in the body of a 29 year old. I am overflowing with energy but I lack the motivation to direct it anywhere. Everything seems stupid and not worth doing. No joy, no fun, no anything. It's a real bummer when you actually have ADHD, yet feel like shit taking amphetamine. When I'm on it, I feel great for the first week. I execute everything I do flawlessly and am on top of my shit. After the first week comes the depersonalization and the nihilism. I become less of a husband and more of an ego. But when I'm off of it, I'm annoying, overly chatty, irresponsible and hyper. I'd go as far to say people would be more likely to think I'm tweaking when I'm not on my medicine (once I get past the 3 day tiredness and depression). I most certainly feel healthier and my skin is already noticeably better. I gained 6 pounds of much needed weight in a week. I hope I can figure out a way to channel this energy into something constructive soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annieadderall Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Your post says you started back in May 2013, is Adderall the only stimulant you have tried? I am in the planning stages of actually quitting with my therapist and psychiatrist, and though our medication histories are certainly a lot different, I would ask your doctor about some kind of less severe medication to help you transition. Though they have been rare, I have had days where I didn't take an Adderall and with running maybe three or so times a week I was able to focus on work with the help of a low dose of Lexapro. I know cold turkey is the gold star way to quit, but it seems like you would be in a good position to try something else to cushion the blow of withdrawal. Especially while you don't have an ambition to put your heart into. xo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted February 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Thanks for the reply. I've tried the SSRI route with Zoloft. It stopped working and the withdrawal was shitty. I hated the brain zaps and I'm convinced that it fucked me up in some ways, as I never really had addiction issues until I quit... Serotonin imbalance is a far slower recovery than dopamine so I won't touch SSRI's with a ten foot pole. I did Adderall until that wore me down, then I moved to pure dextroampetamine since I responded poorly to the levo-amphetamine in the Adderall. It was definitely more helpful, but I inevitably ran into similar problems minus the extreme rage and edginess. I've tried Concerta once and didn't care for it. My younger brother was on Concerta back in grade school and he got horrific side effects so I'd prefer not to use methylphenidate based stimulants. I've tried Modafinil once but the dose may have been too low. I've also tried nootropics like Sunifiram, Noopept, Phenylpiracetam and D-phenylethylamine/Hordenine with somewhat underwhelming results. I'm not sure if there is any type of cross tolerance, but I may give nootropics another shot. I'm seeing my psychiatrist soon to discuss potentially getting on Modafinil or Wellbutrin, but part of me just wants to not rely on meds. I know, I know... stubbornness and high expectations. My psychiatrist certainly didn't "push" my meds on me and I trust that she has my best interest in mind. I was pleasantly surprised that she supported my idea to drastically reduce my dexedrine dose and eventually quit. I'm gonna see what she says. I only hope she doesn't tempt me with the whole "well, we could put you on a more gentle amphetamine based med like Vyvanse." Fuck... Sometimes I get caught up in this idea that maybe some people just ought to be on amphetamine to function and thrive in the world. But the moment I start thinking about how much bullshit the whole esteem/performance based self value is, I contradict myself with "No... fucking NO ONE should spend their whole life on amphetamine." I can't find many amphetamine success stories. Hypothetically, if I were to try a methylphenidate med, would that set back my recovery much? I know they operate differently; amphetamine being similar to methamphetamine, and methylphenidate being similar in structure to cocaine. I think I owe it to myself to at least experience a few months of sobriety before making a decision like this, if not longer. If my work life falls apart, then maybe I'll consider it. Good call on the exercise. I know I have the energy. I just have to fucking do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quit-once Posted February 3, 2015 Report Share Posted February 3, 2015 Fuck... Sometimes I get caught up in this idea that maybe some people just ought to be on amphetamine to function and thrive in the world. But the moment I start thinking about how much bullshit the whole esteem/performance based self value is, I contradict myself with "No... fucking NO ONE should spend their whole life on amphetamine." I can't find many amphetamine success stories. The only amphetamine success stories you will encounter are the new users. I have never heard of a long term relationship with amphetamines or any other kind of speed ending well. I like your idea of forgoing all drugs. Sometimes we need them, like antibiotics, but taking any drug over many, many years just seems like a bad idea to me. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annieadderall Posted February 3, 2015 Report Share Posted February 3, 2015 I would trust yourself when it comes to what you think is best, from your medication experience and the resolve to quit, you may be in the perfect phase to find yourself happy without them. I would honestly share your thoughts you posted here with your therapist and see what recommendations she has. Especially because she seems to pay attention and have your best interests in mind. The only other thing I could suggest (and that you probably already know) is to not be so hard on yourself with the ups and downs of your transition. Exercising for now could just mean taking a short walk to a friend's house or standing up to stretch every once in awhile. Best of luck xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted February 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2015 14 days sober tomorrow! Kinda wanna pop a dexedrine to do my taxes, clean and handle my obligations, but I want to do those things even more WITHOUT amphetamine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LILTEX41 Posted February 5, 2015 Report Share Posted February 5, 2015 Congrats on 14 days! You've made it this far, right? Keep moving forward. Going on dex would be moving backwards. There is an easier more sustainable life for you ahead. Just don't give up! You got this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted February 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2015 Thanks! I'm 16 days clean today. I picked up my guitar and attempted to write music yesterday for the first time in weeks. That felt huge, and strange. I know people love to trash amphetamine here and talk about how it stifles creativity, but I wrote like a fucking champion on it. I was able to shit out awesome riffs and arrange entire songs in one session (a very unhealthy 14 hour session). Listening back on the songs I wrote, I know it will be hard to write the same without dexedrine. That doesn't mean it won't be as good, just different. I'm likely never gonna replicate that manic, sleep deprived flow where I'm not even doing work, but letting my subconscious take the reins and just do it. My work on amphetamine was surprisingly not all that detail oriented. I just went with it (something I could never do while sober). I'm ok with that. I think once I get healthy and "free," I'll still utilize occasional sleep deprivation (minus the drugs) for inspiration and being able to not over analyze everything. When I picked up my guitar yesterday, nothing amazing or interesting happened. It was just fun, unproductive play, something I need after burning myself out so hard for a year straight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searchingsoul9 Posted February 7, 2015 Report Share Posted February 7, 2015 Hi everyone, I've been lurking for quite a while. I've set out on a quest to quit amphetamine a handful of times in the past and this site has been my motivation. What worries me is that I may be one of those people that has a lame frontal lobe, requiring a steady dose of something to stay even remotely interested in most things. I am by no means a tweaker. Sure, I've indulged in higher than prescribed doses and binged on my meds while writing music for days, but that shit really only happened in the beginning and not very frequently. I was originally prescribed 15mg Adderall XR in May, 2013. Tolerance set in and I increased my dose the next month to 15mg IR twice a day. It was a really unnecessary thing to do, as the medication was working as it should have. I just thought that, because the zing and euphoria subsided, it must not be working anymore. I had my occasional fun, usually the day I got my script filled, taking a double dose and just focusing on writing/recording music. I'd occasionally stay up for 48 hours, 72 a few times. That shit started to wear on my quickly, amplifying my previously mild Tic disorder to intense heights. I knew it wasn't sustainable but I figured I'd ask to be switched to dexedrine since it lacked the Levo-Amphetamine portion that Adderall had. I decided to start using responsibly with 20mg dextroamphetamine, which I did for the most part. But even at the lower dosage on the new medication, I still felt a certain depersonalization and dissatisfaction with life. I tried to quit but the lethargy pushed me right back to the pill. But I had a plan this time. I purposely sabotaged myself by having my psychiatrist knock me down to 5mg. I told her I just didn't need it that much anymore. So I managed, with my wife's help dispensing medication, to take just 5mg a day, sometimes 7.5mg, rarely 10mg. I felt a lot better but tolerance is always an issue after about a week. I'm just so sick of the cycle of feeling ok for a few weeks on the pills, then feeling like shit for a week to give myself time to upregulate receptors. Then when I go back my tolerance is low enough where it sometimes keeps me up very late or all night, reinforcing my need to take it everyday just to not pass out at work. I don't even know what my purpose is with posting this. I'm 6 days clean now and I even told my psychiatrist I wanted to quit. I'm just worried that I'll never get my motivation back. I feel lethargic and uninspired and though I can't remember exactly how I felt before I started taking amphetamine, I do know I was in a similar state of blah. I had a pretty mild habit and I just don't know how long I should give myself to feel better before deciding if I need pharmacological intervention. I know I definitely picked up a lot of good habits and coping tools while on amphetamine and I'm just hoping that it will be enough for me to not go back. I wish it was more formulaic. I guess that's why I was drawn to amphetamine, so I could control, analyze and formulate everything. I wish it was as simple as on amphetamine for a little over 1.5 years x average of 20mg tapered down to 5mg = ? This whole post is an amazing display of my rigid, unorganized "sober" brain. How embarrassing. Hi. I personally think you should give it 8-12 months before you decide whether or not you need to find an alternative medication. I know that seems like ages, but your body and mind have become accustom to this drug and it takes a long time to mentally adjust to life without adderall. I know you are not abusing it frequently or on crazy high dosages, but any amount of amphetamine is going to perk you up and give you that focus and energy-so once you stop using it you are going to feel lethargic and tired. Personally, it took me like 6 or 7 months to find some natural motivation. Not saying i just slept and layed in bed all day, i just didn't have that super motivated ambition i once did on adderall. Maybe this was because i was smoking pot, maybe if i had just stayed 100 percent sober i'd have bounced back quicker. Not sure. Anyway, i recommend taking it easy the first week or so. Then slowly try to get back into stuff you like. Writing music for example. Just don't expect that endless creative flow you once had on adderall. That flow WILL return, just not right away. Patience is key, be kind to your body and know that you can achieve anything & you wont need adderall to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searchingsoul9 Posted February 7, 2015 Report Share Posted February 7, 2015 Hi. I personally think you should give it 8-12 months before you decide whether or not you need to find an alternative medication. I know that seems like ages, but your body and mind have become accustom to this drug and it takes a long time to mentally adjust to life without adderall. I know you are not abusing it frequently or on crazy high dosages, but any amount of amphetamine is going to perk you up and give you that focus and energy-so once you stop using it you are going to feel lethargic and tired. Personally, it took me like 6 or 7 months to find some natural motivation. Not saying i just slept and layed in bed all day, i just didn't have that super motivated ambition i once did on adderall. Maybe this was because i was smoking pot, maybe if i had just stayed 100 percent sober i'd have bounced back quicker. Not sure. Anyway, i recommend taking it easy the first week or so. Then slowly try to get back into stuff you like. Writing music for example. Just don't expect that endless creative flow you once had on adderall. That flow WILL return, just not right away. Patience is key, be kind to your body and know that you can achieve anything & you wont need adderall to do it. My bad, i didn't read the other comments until now. You're over two week sober, congrats! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doge Posted February 8, 2015 Report Share Posted February 8, 2015 This thread is awesome. I like reading the transformation. Keep up the updates! I was able to shit out awesome riffs and arrange entire songs in one session (a very unhealthy 14 hour session). I used to do this on guitar and piano too, and I miss it. When I'm romanticizing that past though, my brain conveniently forgets the (possibly long term) damage I did to my wrists due to overuse. Imagine the pain of just not being able to do it ever again. Our body's have limits and adderall doesn't make them go away, it just makes us ignore them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted February 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2015 This thread is awesome. I like reading the transformation. Keep up the updates! I used to do this on guitar and piano too, and I miss it. When I'm romanticizing that past though, my brain conveniently forgets the (possibly long term) damage I did to my wrists due to overuse. Imagine the pain of just not being able to do it ever again. Our body's have limits and adderall doesn't make them go away, it just makes us ignore them. Yes... I remember finally sleeping after being up for days recording music and then waking up in agony, barely able to hold a cup of coffee. I already had tendinitis from drumming (I was really young, self taught with bad technique). Anyway, I guess I'm on day 17 now. My mood is pretty blah. Not worse, but not better either. I hardly feel like I'm in withdrawal anymore. Just bored and uninspired, I suppose. I just ordered a bunch of supplements to possibly speed up the replenishment of neurotransmitters so I can just get on with my fucking life again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doge Posted February 8, 2015 Report Share Posted February 8, 2015 The body certainly recovers faster than the brain. Supplements are great way to help.I don't know if it's hit you but I remember during one of my few times being clean, around the 30 day mark I remember just being hit with a random wave of happiness. It was for no reason, and it didn't last too long but it is something to.Hang in there man we'll be counting months instead of days one day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doge Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 That was supposed to say "something to hold on to, and to make you hold out hope" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doge Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 Haven't heard from you in a little while, how are you doing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted February 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 Hey, thanks for asking. All is ok I guess. 22 days clean. It's getting harder for me. It seems paradoxical in a way. I started feeling great at about 2 weeks, but now I'm declining further into lethargy and depression. Nothing I haven't struggled with before amphetamine I suppose. That was a huge reason I got on them to begin with. It's getting tougher and tougher to distinguish between my shitty normal life and amphetamine withdrawal everyday. I'm goin' for it. Fucking with supplements and trying to be healthier is more of a priority than going back to the pill. I have to at least give myself a shot at being clean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlwaysAwesome Posted February 14, 2015 Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 Have you tried the L-Tyrosine? I just bought some today. We shall see... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 Yeah, paired with DL-phenylalanine (which is a precursor to Tyrosine). I'm also taking L-theanine with caffeine. Didn't notice much of a different so far, probably because I'm used to bombarding my receptors with speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontcare Posted February 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2015 I'm getting a small amount of Adrafinil in the mail today. Gonna give that a shot. I heard tree is no euphoria or recreational value so I'm not worried about getting addicted. I got such a small amount that I wouldn't have the time to get hooked anyway. If it feels "good," I'll know not to order anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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